Bz4X battery charging

59 minutes ago, ernieb said:

Can you post a link?

Easier said than done, but: https://www.toyota.co.uk/new-cars/bz4x

Then, as Craig suggests, scroll down until you find:

and then click on Charging Time or Calculate Range ...

Still off a little.  Best I got yet on a full charge on the AWD Motion was 260 miles (coming up on 400miles).  Today temps 17 degrees.

Charging times look about same as our experience.

But the range is way different from what we are seeing with Motion AWD.  Done just over 3,000 miles so far.

The Toyota website calculator shows for:

London, 10 degrees C, AC Off

Surburban:  300 miles  ( our best is 240 miles* )

City:  334 miles  ( our best is 240 miles* )

Combined:  250 miles ( reasonably close to what we are getting* )

Motorway:  193 miles   ( reasonably close to what we are getting* )

* based on MAX possible , i.e. till zero miles range shown on dash.

Latest figures and example of our calculations / estimates :

SOC        100%        TOTAL DRIVEN:    3157 miles  ( guess-ometer range = 252 miles )

SOC        22%        TOTAL DRIVEN:    3346 miles    ( guess-ometer range = 51 miles )

78% =  189 miles      ( assumed MAX range 242 miles, plus any safety buffer ? )

A questions to you bZ4X owners in Europe.

How often do you charge your car to 100%?

When I received the car from my dealership, the car was set on charge to maximum. But from what I've been reading, it's not healthy for the Battery to be charged to 100% too often?

1 hour ago, qmgtev4VPT6rejrqn said:

A questions to you bZ4X owners in Europe.

How often do you charge your car to 100%?

When I received the car from my dealership, the car was set on charge to maximum. But from what I've been reading, it's not healthy for the battery to be charged to 100% too often?

My dealer says it is no problem to charge to 100% with my level 2 home charger, so I always charge to 100% at home. 

8 hours ago, qmgtev4VPT6rejrqn said:

How often do you charge your car to 100%?

We do that every time using our 7Kw home charger.  Just like we do with our petrol vehicle, fill it right to the top and then use until level is low, low being about 20% SOC for the EV.

We have a dongle that shows the real percentage SOC and it is always lower that the My-T figure.  When the My-T app says 100%, the dongle shows the real SOC as about 92%.  We believe this is Toyota's way of protecting the Battery and preventing it being charged to the actual 100% ???

As Leif says above, it also depends on the type of charging.  The home 7Kw charger is probably much more gentle on the Battery than the big rapid chargers, but even then , the car seems to throttle the charging rate when using a rapid charger.  It will use very high rate , such as 114kWh until the Battery is about 80% SOC, then throttle right down to around 7Kw, at least that's our experience.

So there should not be any need to be concerned ?

8 hours ago, Leffi said:

My dealer says it is no problem to charge to 100% with my level 2 home charger, so I always charge to 100% at home. 

My dealer told me only once every 3 months unless required more frequently. Also if you charge it to 100% then you must set off asap for atrip.

39 minutes ago, leosayer said:

My dealer told me only once every 3 months unless required more frequently. Also if you charge it to 100% then you must set off asap for atrip.

It seems like the Toyota dealers are not that experienced yet when it comes to fully electric cars, and thats why they give different answers to theese questions. 

It's more general knowledge regarding lithium cells, than something specific to EVs - It's fairly well known that lithium cells degrade faster if they're held at very high or low states of charge, e.g. 100% or 0%, for extended periods. Heavy laptop and phone users will likely have noticed this. (Well, less so nowadays since you can't change the Battery in most of them now!)

If you charge it to 100% then immediately go it will have practically no extra degradation, but if it's held at 100% for, say, a week that's not so great for it. Now and then won't make much difference, but if it's done all the time, the cumulative effect is much more noticeable.

The other thing that degrades them faster is rapid charging - The faster they're charged the more degradation they experience. This is why home charging is best - It's much gentler on the pack. Rapid charging now and then will not have a significant impact, but only rapid charging all the time will likely shave a few years off the life of the pack. Even Tesla noticed this, and there have been cases where they've blocked supercharging on cars that do it too much or if the Battery degrades below a certain threshold.

For maximum longevity, lithium cells are supposedly best kept in a cool environment around 50% - I used to store spare batteries at 50% charge in the fridge  

This is also why the hybrids have a strong tendency to keep the charge around 50%, or at least between 20% and 80%, as this extends their lives greatly vs using the full 0% to 100% range, and is why the hybrid batteries have lasted much longer than than EV batteries.

Best to charge to 80% just charge to 100% if you need the extra range.

4 hours ago, lightboxcar said:

We do that every time using our 7Kw home charger.  Just like we do with our petrol vehicle, fill it right to the top and then use until level is low, low being about 20% SOC for the EV.

We have a dongle that shows the real percentage SOC and it is always lower that the My-T figure.  When the My-T app says 100%, the dongle shows the real SOC as about 92%.  We believe this is Toyota's way of protecting the battery and preventing it being charged to the actual 100% ???

As Leif says above, it also depends on the type of charging.  The home 7Kw charger is probably much more gentle on the battery than the big rapid chargers, but even then , the car seems to throttle the charging rate when using a rapid charger.  It will use very high rate , such as 114kWh until the battery is about 80% SOC, then throttle right down to around 7Kw, at least that's our experience.

So there should not be any need to be concerned ?

Which dongle do you use for the bz4x and which app to read the data?

2 minutes ago, Derek.w said:

Best to charge to 80% just charge to 100% if you need the extra range.

Yeah, I think i'll continue to charge to 80-90%

31 minutes ago, Derek.w said:

Best to charge to 80% just charge to 100% if you need the extra range.

Yup, that's the best advice currently given!

On 5/9/2023 at 10:38 PM, qmgtev4VPT6rejrqn said:

Which dongle do you use for the bz4x and which app to read the data

We got this one, it was suggested by another forum member :

https://www.amazon.co.uk/vgate-Bluetooth-scanner-Wireless-Diagnostic/dp/B085Y5BBXX/ref=sr_1_2?keywords=vgate+icar+pro&qid=1683762849&sprefix=vgate+icar%2Caps%2C66&sr=8-2

You just plug it into the OBD port under the steering wheel area.  Then get the Car Scanner app , we got the Car Scanner ELM OBD2 app, it connects via bluetooth to the dongle, all quite simple to use.

Hope that helps

Similar topics merged.

Hi, 

As per the title, anyone know the confirmed minimum charge rate for the BZ4x? For most EVs its 1.4kwh

Asking re charging via solar 

thanks

S.

I'm not sure that I understand the question ... the minimum charge rate will be 0 kW - that being when you have achieved 100% charge and the car will take no more. Otherwise, provided you have 230v available, the car should accept charge at whatever rate the source can support up to a maximum of 7 / 11 kW depending on the onboard charger.

Similar topics merged.

40 minutes ago, philip42h said:

I'm not sure that I understand the question ... the minimum charge rate will be 0 kW - that being when you have achieved 100% charge and the car will take no more. Otherwise, provided you have 230v available, the car should accept charge at whatever rate the source can support up to a maximum of 7 / 11 kW depending on the onboard charger.

You can set your home charger to only use solar energy to charge your car. There is however a minimum charge that needs to be achieved in order for the charging to take place. As i understand for most cars its 1.4 kwh, meaning that the system has to generate at least 1.4kwh excess in order for the car to accept the charge. What i am trying to understand is whether the BZ4x has this threshold or a different (higher?) one and whether my PV system can do this or not.

1 hour ago, swoop5511 said:

You can set your home charger to only use solar energy to charge your car. There is however a minimum charge that needs to be achieved in order for the charging to take place. As i understand for most cars its 1.4 kwh, meaning that the system has to generate at least 1.4kwh excess in order for the car to accept the charge. What i am trying to understand is whether the BZ4x has this threshold or a different (higher?) one and whether my PV system can do this or not.

OK, speaking as someone who knows 'diddly squat' I've done 30 seconds worth of research ... 😉

There is no lower limit  of charge rate set by the car - bZ4X or any other EV.

There is a lower limit set by the EV charger - the standards arbitrarily set this at 6A. In the UK that would equate to 1.38kW at 230V = 1.4kW between friends. Note kW, not kWh.

What actually happens will depend on your EV charger. If your solar array is unable to deliver 6A at 230V it will either simply stop charging and let to surplus flow to the grid, or draw a total of 6A from the grid and your solar array combined. You would need to understand the design behaviour of your EV charging solution - the fact that you are charging a bZ4X has no bearing on the behaviour.

On 2/27/2023 at 11:44 AM, dab1054 said:

Doing a quick calculation on available battery information- bZ4X total battery is 71.4kWH and usable is 64kWh so that means that the battery should never charge beyond 89.6% of total capacity (at least as it is currently configured) even if this is displayed as 100%. I guess Toyota engineers do have a lot of serious experience with EV/hybrid batteries right from the early days of the Prius. This was a big factor when I decided to go for the bZ4X.

The only downside to charging to 100% seems to be that you lose regenerative breaking for a while.

Loss of regen braking is only for about 5 miles or down to 97-98% SOC